Number of fixtures + physical light switch

[Fabott]

Hi,

I doing research for how to start controlling our house lights in our theatre. Currently we are using Crestron to DALI, but we are changing to QSYS.

The DALI core looks compelling, but I just want to check some things before I order.

I read that there is a maximum of 64 DALI addresses, is it possible to daisy-chain the DALI-core, or should I use multiple in my QSYS set-up?

Instead of having screens everywhere I would like to control the house-lights with a normal physical switch. Will this On/Off command confuse the DALI-core?

With that I meen, if I switch on the lights with a physical switch, will the DALI-core override this when it reads that there is a different value than what it has sendt out?

Thanks in advance for helping!

[Jorge Solano]

Hello Fabott,

First of all thanks for reaching out and for the clear explanation

One DaliCore controls one DALI bus, so the limit is 64 DALI addresses per DALI line. You cannot daisy-chain DaliCores to extend the same DALI bus. If you need more than 64 DALI addresses, the best solution is to split the installation over multiple DALI lines and use one DaliCore per line. Q-SYS can then control the DaliCores over the network, for example by UDP or OSC.

For the physical switch: this will not confuse the DaliCore, as long as it is used as a control input and not as a mains power switch for the drivers. The clean solution is to use a dry-contact wall switch connected to Q-SYS or directly to one of the DaliCore GPI inputs. That switch can then trigger a scene, group or on/off command.

The DaliCore does not automatically override the lights just because it sees a different value. But if another DALI controller and the DaliCore are both sending commands on the same DALI bus, then normally the last command wins.

So in short: multiple DaliCores for multiple DALI lines, and use the physical switch as a trigger, not as a power cut.

Hope this helps!

[Fabott]

Thank you for the clear explanation, Jorge!

I'll take that with me in designing the installation.

Kind regards,
Fabian

[Jorge Solano]

You're welcome Fabian!

Wish you luck on your installation

[Fabott]

Hi again, Jorge!

This project has been dormant over the summer holidays, but now I'm picking up the threads from before summer.

A thing I was wondering about, is if I, instead of a dry-switch, can use a netpanel B4? Am I correct to think this would increase the flexibility of the installation?

Is there a plugin in the Qsys designer to incorporate the Netpanel into my QSYS design? EDIT: I was a bit to quick with asking for help, I found the qplug on the Netpanel page.

Kind regards,
Fabian

[Jorge Solano]

Hi Fabian,

Good to hear from you again 

Yes, a NetPanel B4 can be a good alternative to a dry-contact switch and it would indeed give you more flexibility. You get four networked buttons, short/long press options, LED feedback and a cleaner integration with Q-SYS compared to a simple contact input.

For your setup I would normally think in this direction:

NetPanel B4 → Q-SYS → DaliCore → DALI house lights

So Q-SYS remains the main logic controller, the NetPanel is the wall interface, and Q-SYS sends the required commands to the DaliCore.

Regarding the plugin: the B-Station plugin should not be assumed to work with the NetPanel. They are different product families. For the NetPanel B4 you should use the dedicated NetPanel B4 Q-SYS plugin.
https://api.visualproductions.nl/api/download/69a6acf6c0671a3935ac0a1f

I would only choose a B-Station2 instead if you specifically need the six physical buttons or its local standalone lighting-controller features. For a clean Q-SYS wall-control interface, the NetPanel B4 sounds like the better fit.

For better detailed troubleshooting confirm me how many wall panels you need, whether PoE Ethernet is available at those locations, and if Q-SYS will be the main brain for all room logic.

Hope this helps!

[Fabott]

Thanks again, Jorge!

I found the netpanel qplug, right before I read your comment, thanks! I thnik the netpanel is a better choice for our installation.

A follow up question: Would it be possible to assign two buttons of the netpanel to the Dali-core, and the other two to a Cuecore?

What I'm thinking now is that I could assign button 1 + 2 to house lights and working lights on stage. Button 3 + 4 could be assigned to trigger some presets in the Cue-core for small presentations.

There is a network connection with POE at the wall outlets.

In our main stage we would need 3 netpanels, our smaler venue needs only two.

[Jorge Solano]

You are welcome Fabian

Yes, that is possible, and this is actually a good use case for the NetPanel.

I would not think of it as assigning button 1 and 2 directly to the DaliCore, and button 3 and 4 directly to the CueCore. The cleaner way is to let the NetPanel send all button events into Q-SYS, and then let Q-SYS decide which device should be controlled.

So the flow would be:

NetPanel B4 → Q-SYS → DaliCore / CueCore

For example, button 1 could trigger a DaliCore scene for house lights, button 2 a DaliCore scene for stage work lights, and button 3 and 4 could trigger CueCore presets or playbacks for small presentations.

This also makes sense with multiple panels. Each NetPanel would have its own IP address and its own plugin instance in Q-SYS, but they can all trigger the same Q-SYS logic if you want them to behave identically.

The PoE network points at the wall outlets are ideal for this.

One thing to check: which CueCore model are you planning to use? If it is a CueCore3, the Q-SYS plugin route is probably the cleanest. If it is a CueCore2, we may need to use OSC/UDP/TCP commands instead.

For the DaliCore side I would normally recommend triggering prepared scenes, like house lights, work lights, presentation mode, audience in, etc. That keeps the system simple and reliable.

Hope this helps!

[Fabott]

Your explanation helped a lot, Jorge

I was just trying to decide if I would go for the Cue-core3 or 2. But the easier routing options with QSYS-designer is a big pluss for the Cue-core 3.

Do you know if I need to program a master fader in the Qsys plugin, or will the preprogrammed scenes run independant of a master/chanel fader?

[Jorge Solano]

Great, that makes sense Fabian 

CueCore3 is indeed the better choice here if you want the cleaner Q-SYS routing and integration.

For your question: no, you do not need to create a master fader in Q-SYS just to run pre-programmed CueCore3 scenes or presets.

The normal workflow would be to program the lighting looks directly inside the CueCore3, for example as playbacks or cues, and then let Q-SYS simply trigger the correct playback or cue.

So for example:

NetPanel button 3 → Q-SYS → CueCore3 presentation preset 1
NetPanel button 4 → Q-SYS → CueCore3 presentation preset 2

In that case, the levels and fades are stored in the CueCore3, and Q-SYS is only sending the trigger command.

A master fader in Q-SYS is optional. I would only add it if you want manual overall dimming from the Q-SYS interface, for example a “presentation lighting master”. If you do add one, make sure it initializes at 100%, otherwise it could accidentally reduce the output while the CueCore3 preset itself is running correctly.

So for fixed presentation presets, I would keep it simple and just trigger the CueCore3 playbacks or cues from Q-SYS.

Hope this helps!